Dbox and Exim

[C Peters]

The Dovecot wiki [1] doesn't list either Exim, Postfix or anything
else as supporting the dbox. I did some searching in the Exim
archives and have found only one message mentioning dbox, sdbox or
mdbox. [2] I think an RFC would go a long way towards getting the
format supported. Has Timo, or anyone else, considered submitting an
RFC to the IETF?

My question was how are we going to use it if Exim doesn't support it.
It looks like we can filter it and convert it with dovecot-lda. [3]
I have generally avoided using Procmail for a few years because of
various problems and it's a dead software project that hasn't been
developed in what 15 to 20 years. I am thinking about trying it with
Exim's built in Maildrop filtering support. Has anybody tried that?
What else are people using to enable dbox?


The more specific question on the problem I am trying to solve. I
have been using mbox for years, and I can't even get Dovecot, IMAP and
Thunderbird working on the LAN because it can't handle the GB's of old
mail. Mutt works on the local machine, but I want something that
works while I am using something other than ssh and mutt. For example
I want to try Mailpile and K9. I would like to try dbox, but given
it's lack of support in Exim or Postfix, I'll probably convert to
maildir.

Thanks,
Chuck


1. http://wiki2.dovecot.org/MailboxFormat
1. https://lists.exim.org/lurker/message/20110220.014144.87010abd.en.html
Thread view: https://lists.exim.org/lurker/thread/20110216.223226.015539ba.en.html#i20110216.223226.015539ba
2. http://ramblings.narrabilis.com/mdboxprocmail

[Philon]

Hi Chuck,

I?m really curious as to if I really understand you correctly. Neither Exim
nor Postfix do need to support any mailbox format. They both should hand
incoming mail to either LDA or LMTP. You can use sieve and managesieve for
filtering and there even is a Thunderbird plugin for managing the filters.
So all in all it should be pretty convenient. I don't see why dovecot
should not be able to handle multiple GBs of mail, even on a local network.


Philon

You might want to check here:
http://wiki2.dovecot.org/LDA/Exim
http://wiki2.dovecot.org/LMTP/Exim

Post by C Peters
The Dovecot wiki [1] doesn't list either Exim, Postfix or anything
else as supporting the dbox. I did some searching in the Exim
archives and have found only one message mentioning dbox, sdbox or
mdbox. [2] I think an RFC would go a long way towards getting the
format supported. Has Timo, or anyone else, considered submitting an
RFC to the IETF?
My question was how are we going to use it if Exim doesn't support it.
It looks like we can filter it and convert it with dovecot-lda. [3]
I have generally avoided using Procmail for a few years because of
various problems and it's a dead software project that hasn't been
developed in what 15 to 20 years. I am thinking about trying it with
Exim's built in Maildrop filtering support. Has anybody tried that?
What else are people using to enable dbox?
The more specific question on the problem I am trying to solve. I
have been using mbox for years, and I can't even get Dovecot, IMAP and
Thunderbird working on the LAN because it can't handle the GB's of old
mail. Mutt works on the local machine, but I want something that
works while I am using something other than ssh and mutt. For example
I want to try Mailpile and K9. I would like to try dbox, but given
it's lack of support in Exim or Postfix, I'll probably convert to
maildir.
Thanks,
Chuck
1. http://wiki2.dovecot.org/MailboxFormat
1. https://lists.exim.org/lurker/message/20110220.014144.87010abd.en.html
https://lists.exim.org/lurker/thread/20110216.223226.015539ba.en.html#i20110216.223226.015539ba
2. http://ramblings.narrabilis.com/mdboxprocmail

[Will Yardley]

Post by Philon
I?m really curious as to if I really understand you correctly. Neither Exim
nor Postfix do need to support any mailbox format. They both should hand
incoming mail to either LDA or LMTP.

Postfix has an LDA (local(8)). I believe Exim also has a builtin LDA.

local(8) - Postfix local mail delivery

Postfix's LDA can write to both Maildir and mbox mailboxes.

Of course, both MTAs let you specify an external LDA, but both do have
builtin ones.

w

[Benny Pedersen]

Post by C Peters
it's lack of support in Exim or Postfix, I'll probably convert to
maildir.

Why not use dovecot lmtp or dovecot lda ?, postfix or exim dont need to
store mails in sql like dbmail does, but dbmail have a lda or lmtp aswell,
problem solved no ?

[Timo Sirainen]

Post by C Peters
The Dovecot wiki [1] doesn't list either Exim, Postfix or anything
else as supporting the dbox. I did some searching in the Exim
archives and have found only one message mentioning dbox, sdbox or
mdbox. [2] I think an RFC would go a long way towards getting the
format supported. Has Timo, or anyone else, considered submitting an
RFC to the IETF?

No, and I don't want it to happen anytime in near future. The dbox format is highly Dovecot-specific, because it relies on Dovecot's index files. These index files are still changing and I'm not sure if they will ever be fully finished. I don't want any other software to even attempt to implement the same functionality.

Post by C Peters
My question was how are we going to use it if Exim doesn't support it.

As others said, use LMTP or dovecot-lda with Sieve filtering.

[Andre Rodier]

Post by Timo Sirainen

Post by C Peters
The Dovecot wiki [1] doesn't list either Exim, Postfix or anything
else as supporting the dbox. I did some searching in the Exim
archives and have found only one message mentioning dbox, sdbox or
mdbox. [2] I think an RFC would go a long way towards getting the
format supported. Has Timo, or anyone else, considered submitting an
RFC to the IETF?

No, and I don't want it to happen anytime in near future. The dbox format is highly Dovecot-specific, because it relies on Dovecot's index files. These index files are still changing and I'm not sure if they will ever be fully finished. I don't want any other software to even attempt to implement the same functionality.

Post by C Peters
My question was how are we going to use it if Exim doesn't support it.

As others said, use LMTP or dovecot-lda with Sieve filtering.

Hi,

I am sorry if I am presumptuous or out of topic, but it seems to me that
the mail storage should be standardised.

I am still using Maildir myself, simply because I like the simplicity,
one file is one email, one directory is one email folder, for backup or
restore.

The only thing I don't like is the naming convention, but I don't know
if a file system exists today to store such information in label or tags
associated to each file.

Regarding the optimisation, I think it's the file system's role, albeit
I appreciate Dovecot's efforts to optimise the storage by taking in
consideration file system's specificities.

A feature I would like, is dovecot being able to store emails in
databases, SQL or NoSQL. I would use this for archiving and queries
purposes. MariaDB / Drizzle, or MongoDB, CouchDB, etc. There is plenty
of choice.

Maybe this storage scheme would be slower, but IMHO, this is not a
problem when people just want to archive their emails on a remote computer.

Maybe I could start this if I had some template or example to start.

Kind regards,
Andr?.

[Robert Schetterer]

Post by Andre Rodier

Post by Timo Sirainen

Post by C Peters
The Dovecot wiki [1] doesn't list either Exim, Postfix or anything
else as supporting the dbox. I did some searching in the Exim
archives and have found only one message mentioning dbox, sdbox or
mdbox. [2] I think an RFC would go a long way towards getting the
format supported. Has Timo, or anyone else, considered submitting an
RFC to the IETF?

No, and I don't want it to happen anytime in near future. The dbox
format is highly Dovecot-specific, because it relies on Dovecot's
index files. These index files are still changing and I'm not sure if
they will ever be fully finished. I don't want any other software to
even attempt to implement the same functionality.

Post by C Peters
My question was how are we going to use it if Exim doesn't support it.

As others said, use LMTP or dovecot-lda with Sieve filtering.

Hi,
I am sorry if I am presumptuous or out of topic, but it seems to me that
the mail storage should be standardised.

Not really, its good to have many options

Post by Andre Rodier
I am still using Maildir myself, simply because I like the simplicity,
one file is one email, one directory is one email folder, for backup or
restore.
The only thing I don't like is the naming convention, but I don't know
if a file system exists today to store such information in label or tags
associated to each file.
Regarding the optimisation, I think it's the file system's role, albeit
I appreciate Dovecot's efforts to optimise the storage by taking in
consideration file system's specificities.
A feature I would like, is dovecot being able to store emails in
databases, SQL or NoSQL. I would use this for archiving and queries
purposes. MariaDB / Drizzle, or MongoDB, CouchDB, etc. There is plenty
of choice.

agreed, its good to have more options

Post by Andre Rodier
Maybe this storage scheme would be slower, but IMHO, this is not a
problem when people just want to archive their emails on a remote computer.

why not using bcc stuff with i.e postfix

perhaps see

https://sys4.de/de/blog/2013/02/07/mailarchiv-mit-dovecot-und-postfix-sortiert-nach-datum-mailadressen-und-ein-ausgehend-unterordnern/

sorry german

Post by Andre Rodier
Maybe I could start this if I had some template or example to start.
Kind regards,
Andr?.

Best Regards
MfG Robert Schetterer

[Benny Pedersen]

Post by Robert Schetterer
sorry german

Why sorry ?, its more sad to see it repeated

Men m?ske skulle jeg bare skrive bl?b?rgr?d ? :)

[Robert Schetterer]

Post by Benny Pedersen

Post by Robert Schetterer
sorry german

Why sorry ?, its more sad to see it repeated
Men m?ske skulle jeg bare skrive bl?b?rgr?d ? :)

jIyajbe'


Best Regards
MfG Robert Schetterer

[Timo Sirainen]

Post by Timo Sirainen

Post by C Peters
The Dovecot wiki [1] doesn't list either Exim, Postfix or anything
else as supporting the dbox. I did some searching in the Exim
archives and have found only one message mentioning dbox, sdbox or
mdbox. [2] I think an RFC would go a long way towards getting the
format supported. Has Timo, or anyone else, considered submitting an
RFC to the IETF?

No, and I don't want it to happen anytime in near future. The dbox format is highly Dovecot-specific, because it relies on Dovecot's index files. These index files are still changing and I'm not sure if they will ever be fully finished. I don't want any other software to even attempt to implement the same functionality.

I am sorry if I am presumptuous or out of topic, but it seems to me that the mail storage should be standardised.
I am still using Maildir myself, simply because I like the simplicity, one file is one email, one directory is one email folder, for backup or restore.

Sure, mbox and Maildir are pretty standard. And Maildir is especially good if you care about reliability more than performance. But dbox was especially designed for performance - trying to standardize it in any way would limit the ability to improve its performance in future. So dbox isn't really meant for people who want to use any kind of a standard, it's for people who want as good performance from Dovecot as possible.

A feature I would like, is dovecot being able to store emails in databases, SQL or NoSQL. I would use this for archiving and queries purposes. MariaDB / Drizzle, or MongoDB, CouchDB, etc. There is plenty of choice.

Dovecot's (commercial) object storage plugin could probably be used with NoSQL servers. We've been looking into Cassandra support at least.

Maybe this storage scheme would be slower, but IMHO, this is not a problem when people just want to archive their emails on a remote computer.
Maybe I could start this if I had some template or example to start.

There's a very old SQL storage plugin for Dovecot. It would require a lot of work though:

http://dovecot.org/patches/mail-sql.patch
http://dovecot.org/patches/mail-sql.tar.gz

There is actually also a working read-only SQL storage plugin that supports only INBOX. I could send the sources for that as well.